Sorry still no photos. But we're learning more about Nurlan. Although he's 5-1/2, he's really functioning on a 3-4 year-old level. He has a definite attention problem. He gets frustrated when he can't draw shapes. Doesn't like to color. Has a hard time memorizing things. In school, he was given six pictures (three clouds and three leaves) and was instructed to place the clouds and the leaves where they belong on the page. Instead of clouds on top and leaves on bottom, he stuck a cloud in with the leaves and glued them to the bottom of the page. When told that's wrong, he got frustrated and cried. All of this are classic signs of institutionalized children who are way behind the curve. So we'll have our hands full, trying to help him catch up. In my opinion, he's not ready for kindergarten this fall. He also looks younger than his chronological age, so should we bump his age back on his birth certificate?
Any thoughts on any of this? We could really use your help.
19 comments:
Good question on the birth certificate. If it any consolation my boys (both bio) get their pics messed up too and their Picasso-esque drawings are all over the house.
I would think that this is a short term issue and he will catch up quickly with the right attention. My boys both were slightly delayed in various areas so I hired a tutor to do one on one with them and that really helped. First off it took me out of the picture (so all the behaviors they reserve for Mom were not there) and then they were forced to focus on what they were learning. Although expensive, it helped them catch up.
No need to worry -- he will catch up quickly.
I don't know about the birth certficate either. I know there was a lot of posts about it on the yahoo boards recently, but i didn't read them that well *(sorry) but i bet you could check the archives.
I think he will catch up quickly too with some one on one attention from you. I think the tutor is a great idea. You can check out to see what your state offers-I remember hearing how other adoptive parents got their kids tested and got some help (if they needed it)
Also, it seems boys sometimes dont catch on as quickly. That was the case with SEan. He was having issues writing his name, and cutting with scissors, all fine motor school things. We practiced a lot and he eventually figured it out.
Poor Garrett-I am sure that is frustrating for him. I think that the one on one attention from you guys is going to help him a lot.
I bet Suzanne has read a book on this and she can give you some great advice.
Love you!
I saw a thread about changing the age on the birth certificate. I can try to track it down and send it to you. I think I have your email. I am sure we have all sorts of therapies here that will help. Last year, Luca's teacher thought he had Asperger's and you would not believe how quickly they pounced on him. Did you check out Suzanne's Resources blog? I would love to help. Let me know if there is anything I can do - areinoehl (at) yahoo (dot) com. I am traveling today, but will look for the birth certificate discussion and email it to you.
He sounds like a typical Boy. I know we had originally wanted an older child when we were waiting for referral(we got a 4 month old at referral) and we asked questions about this to our doctor. He said that you have to be careful about changing ages, because even if they don't catch up on the mental side they will always catch up on the physical side. Then they will be going through puberty and adolescence way before every one else and it will cause more metnal problems then they already have. It sounds to me that with a litlle tutoring and therapy he will catch up real soon!! Hang in there, it is a crazy ride. Maybe you should talk to some people who have adopted older children from Kaz that have been there done that.
I honestly wouldn't wory too much about the picture thing, Jabari will be 5 in June & he won't put things were they actually belong sometimes. He has problems following instructions sometimes too, (i.e. if he gets overwhelmed or nervous & then he puts his hands on his face & he has cried sometimes too). I have learned to not push him & even if its not "right" to still say how awesome the picture looks, he has gained self confidence through that & it has helped so much with school stuff. I would imagine Nurlan feels pressure to perform & be perfect by what his caregives have told him about getting a family & that makes it so stressful to the point that he can't relax & truly listen, this was Jabari's deal. I can tell once he gets overwhelmed & stressed he doesn't understand whats going. I have also asked Jabari "where are clouds at" verses "put the clouds in the sky", it gets them to think & I have read to give kids 8 sec. to respond to a question, it really does work at least most of the time. With J I have learned to also show him what I mean it depends on what kind of learner Nurlan is, is he auditory, visual or Kinstectic/tactile. Jabari is mostly a kinstectic learner, he does really well on things if I show him how to do something first. It's really interesting when you learn about learning styles, I'm a visual learner & Thad is a auditory, he will often forget & just try & explain to me how to do something & my brain can't process it, I need to be shown something & then I get it.
The worse thing I have done with Jabari is look what the skills of an almost 5yr. old should be doing by the experts standards & try & push him to that level, I have made myself except the fact that he is not like most other almost 5yr olds & thats ok.
I hope this helps, sorry it got so long. :)
No expert opinion here - but I would probably change the age if you already know he is behind. It can't actually HURT to give him more time - and boys lag behind girls anyway with a lot of social and educational skills. There will be other boys who have been held back in his class probably.
It is true that he might then develop earlier physically - but one year is not that much really. Physical development already varies by quite a bit within just one grade level anyway.
My son had a year in day care before he started pre-school and he is on par with his peers; while my daughter went straight to school and she is far behind. so if you can "buy" him more time, I'd do it. This will give him a year to learn the language, learn how to live in a family, get comfortable with his surroundings and with you. and he won't really be able to truly learn anything else from school until he learns the language first anyway.
However I would also add that time with other kids is so so so important - neither of mine learned English appreciably when they came home with me (at ages 3 and 7) - but when they started daycare and school respectively, and were around other kids, they learned in leaps and bounds. So if you opt to change his age and keep him out of kindergarten - you might also want to consider joining a play group with him (unless of course he is in day care).
just another perspective. too long probably :)
Lisa
Oh my, this is a very difficult decision. I wish I had some words of wisdom, but I do not. What a beautiful thing that you are already thinking of every possible way you can help your son along. here is what we do know for sure: It is VERY challenging to bring home a baby from an institution (or toddler or child) but these kids are so shockingly resilient and with your love and attention and focus and support and even some professional help, he'll blossom into whoever he is going to be - beautifully. I have to say that after 9 weeks at home, we are wiped out - but it is the best most amazing thing ever and Aila is blossoming. Your sweetie will too. It is just quite a challenge.
Holy deja vu.
Rewind 3.5 years and you are exactly where John and I were with Ethan. When you get home, we will need to get together for dinner as there is no possible way to write as much as I have to say about this subject.
Ethan was 5 when he came home. His bone age (per Dana Johnson's group) was that of a 3 year old. Cognitive fuction was around 3 as well. Ethan has come sooo far, but we always need to measure him on his own stick. We have been frustrated many times with the schools, and many times with him and many times with ourselves but we also realize where he would be at if he never came home with us either.
As far as the birth certificate thing goes I am still torn to know if we did the right thing. We did NOT change Ethan's age but have often wondered if it would have helped US (not him) to accept is young behaviors more acceptingly. I don't know how many times we have faced guilt after scolding him for his young behaviors and saying, "you're 8 years old but acting like a 4 year old!"
On the flip side we also know someone who is now 20. He was a good friend of the kid who lived next door to us. He was adopted from cambodia and his parents DID change his age. He found out when he was 18 because of legal stuff and he was very upset by it and solidified the a rift that was already in their relationship.
Not sure what to tell you. My best advice is that it may be better for you if you change the age. If your realationship with Nurlan goes as we all hope for and your bond with him turns out strong, then perhaps you will get through it with no issues if and when he does discover his actual age. But remember that is will be hard for him to find out later that he has been told a white lie his whole life - even if it was for everyone's own good.
I am long winded, so my final piece of advice is send him to Fraser School in Richfield for a year. They have a great staff and we found it was one of the few places that could handle Ethan when we first came home. They have kids there that are mainstream as well as special needs and it is a great environment with support you will need.
OK, so dinner, our place, upon your arrival home.
Michelle
P.S.
Dying to see a picture!
OK, just read my post. By what I wrote, I think it sounded like my advice was to change his age on the B.C. - But that's not what I meant.
I really don't know what to tell you. I stand by our decision to NOT change the age because I think in the end it is best for Ethan to know the truth. It always comes out in one way or another.
I was just trying to make a point for both sides.
Good luck in your decision.
Michelle
Hi Karen,
No advice but I wonder if Barb from our book group could give some good insights, having worked with children for so long. Can you e-mail her or if you'd like, I can contact her and have her contact you via e-mail or blog. Let me know and good luck with this complicated decision. My heart goes out to you and Bob and Nurlan with these difficult decisions. Blessings, Rochelle
I'm not sure what the answer is to the BC issue. For sure, if you do change his name I would never ever ever ever ever tell him. Never. I cannot imagine how I would feel like today if I found out that I've thought I'm the wrong age and no one told me. If you do it, do it and forget it. Burn any evidence of it.
I guess clouds could look like snow. There are developmental tests that are available to you in the US under the IDEA act (disabilities act). Info is on my Resource blog.
There are ways to get around some of the restrictions in the IDEA act that are in the Out of Sync Book starting on page 217 through 247. Good think I bookmarked it.
Sorry the IDEA act covers developmental tests and treatments and things the school system are required to offer you. Its regulated state by state and school district by district so you'll have to check what is available in your hometown. Again, you can get links from http://kazadoptresources.blogspot.com/2008/01/early-intervention.html
Heres the MN link http://www.adopting.org/uni/frame.php?url=http://www.nectac.org/search/mapfinder.asp
And general here
http://www.adopting.org/uni/frame.php?url=http://www.familyvillage.wisc.edu/education/ei.html
If the links go off the page in my posting you can copy and paste into word or wherever - the whole thing will show up.
I just left a message on this question for my closest friend, who is a PhD level school psychologist; she works primarily with assessing learning disabilities and other special educational needs in immigrant children (and other children for whom English is a second language). My guess is that if you change Nurlan's age, it will affect what kinds of special educational assistance he can receive when he does start school. But I'll let you know what my friend thinks when I hear.
I'm really enjoying following your trip!
Barbara (Vietnam PAP, still waiting for a referral....)
Lisa does have good points, but I'm pretty firmly on the side of leaving his age as it is (unless you have some hard evidence that it's wildly incorrect). Being older and delayed qualifies him for more services, you don't know how quickly he'll develop with attention and nutrition, and since you're changing his name, the only thing left of his origins will be his birthdate.
There will be another chance to change the age when you file re-adoption/domestication papers later on in the US. By then you'll have more information on his cognitive and physical development & progress, and can be more sure in your choices.
My son started kindergarten at 7; I'm sure you can find a way to keep Nurlan out of school for a year, or find a pre-school situation for him, and start him in K at 6. For sure he won't be the only one!
Wow, this all sounds so interesting and frustrating at the same time. I've never been in your position as adoptive parents, but since you are asking for opinions, I'll give you mine.
Usually starting out with a lie (such as changing a birthdate or anything else), always comes back to bite you later. Better to try and start him in K a bit later.
There are plenty of kids who get off to a slow start. I'm sure with your help and the help of tutors, teachers, etc., along with the great home life you and Bob will provide, he will catch up, both in his intellect and maturity levels.
Karen & Bob. I don't know what the right answer is regarding changing the age. I have mixed feelings because I do think that Garrett will make up some (probably even a lot of) ground once he is home, but only time will tell.
My sister is a kindergarten teacher in an inclusion classroom-- special ed kids mixed in with regular ed students-- and when I asked her, she made these points:
1) Where we live, services (like speech or OT) stop being offered by the county at age 5-- after a child turns 5, the only way to get (free) services is to enroll in school;
2) Every year, she has students ranging in age from 4 to 6, so being 6 in kindergarten is not so uncommon.. She says the older kid in her classroom actually like being older than all the other kids-- it makes them "the big cheese" (and I guess in turn would be a source of self-esteem?);
3) These older kids in her class are regular ed, but I asked if there was any issues for the kids if younger kids were "ahead" of them in terms of skills, but she said in kindergarten they are not competitive yet-- so even if some of the 5 years are better at some/all skills, it isn't a source of anxiety or poor self esteem;
4) My sister can always spot the kids who have not had any preschool/nursery school, and they usually lag behind (sometimes education-wise, sometimes socially), at least for a little while.
When is Nurlan's birthday? If you didn't change his age, and sent him to preschool in the fall instead of kindergarten, would he only be 6 when he went to kindergarten? Or 7? If he is only going to be 6, I probably wouldn't change his age and just delay his entry into school. If he was going to be 7, I might lean more towards a small age rewind. But what do I know? :) All of the points and opinions here are great, but everyone's situation is just "thismuch" different.. You guys are there with him, and can judge better than any of us-- and remember that your love and support is going to carry him a long way.
Jeannine
This is such a tough subject. To me it seems like it might be disrespecting the child in some way to change his birth date. Sort of like you don't care about his birthday. I think it could cause a rift between you later in life as well. I do understand why people change it due to delays, but if you had a biological child with delays would you change his date of birth to reflect his abilities and size?
I have heard that a child is less likely to receive any special education they may need when you have changed their age. They will be judged by their "new" age and so real delays will not seem like delays based on that new age. Your son might benefit from the help he would receive if he qualified for them based on his delays.
We are going through early intervention screening with Dmitrii right now and he will qualify for free programs with speech therapy and motor skills because of his delays. There are programs in place to help these kids out and in my opinion that is the way to go.
If you are worried about him being behind in school you might consider homeschooling. I don't know if that is an option for you or not. Many adoptive parents choose to homeschool for the first couple of years to help their child get caught up and then enroll them in public school. You can still take advantage of special programs through your public school even if you homeschool.
Sorry, this is long but it's a topic worthy of long comments like the ones you have received. My personal opinion is that changing the DOB doesn't feel right to me. In the end though, this is YOUR son and you need to do what feels right for your family. The right answer is always the one that feels right to you!!!
I heard back from my friend, the elementary school psychologist. For what it's worth, she feels really strongly that you should not change his age for both psychological and practical reasons. Apparently even if Nurlan is not ready for kindergarten, if he is assessed as delayed, he'll qualify for developmental services that would help him catch up. As others have noted, if you lower his age, it will limit the services available to you, both before and after he starts school. I think you both are doing such a wonderful job of coping with the complexities of this adoption. He's a blessed little boy to be gaining you as parents!
--Barbara
That's a dilemma and I'm sure that other parents have their experiences to share. In the meantime - you can tell people that he is the creative type. A Picasso in the making!
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